Natural Language Processing = SEO Superpowers

This week we are joined by Rob Hoang, an SEO Specialist at Local Digital and a guru when it comes to Natural Language Processing. It’s an interesting topic, and when it comes to SEO its something we have had a lot of success with – so much so we have created the software Natch to help with the process, which we also talk about a little in the episode. We delve in to what natural language processing is and how we use it to improve our Google visibility so it’s all actionable stuff this week.

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TRANSCRIPT

Local Digital  0:04
It’s time for the SEO show where a couple of nerds talk search engine optimization, so you can learn to compete in Google and grow your business online. Now, here’s your host, Michael and Arthur.

Michael  0:23
Welcome to a very, very special episode of The FCO show. Now I know I sort of say that every week, but this week, it really is special because after 23 episodes, we’ve got author in the house. Hello. Because Michael in the house, and we’ve got Rob in the house.

Rob  0:38
Yes, that’s me. Rob. Is FF guest. Hello? Yeah. Oh, yeah, I’m good. I’m good. I’m good. Um, yeah, I think he asked you.

Michael  0:49
I’m glad to hear you. Good. Maybe I should explain a bit more about who Rob is and why it’s here. Yeah, it’s a good idea. Well, today we’re going to talk about natural language processing. And Rob is a guru when it comes to natural language processing. Right. So maybe tell us who you are and what you do.

Rob  1:05
Yeah. I’m Rob. I’m the SEO specialist. Local, digital. And can confirm Yeah, microphone. The man any nicknames? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I go by many names, including speed demon. They call me defense. ridiculous, ridiculous and

Arthur  1:26
out of context would be good. Maybe? Maybe not. Let’s not go into

Michael  1:29
a little bit of mystery. But exactly, exactly.

Rob  1:31
And most recently, they called me annihilation nation.

Arthur  1:35
We still don’t know who they are.

Michael  1:38
I have a feeling they. But anyway, the reason why bringing it on but you know, when he’s got that many nicknames he must know a thing or two about language, right? Am I going to be talking natural language processing, because this is a little bit of a cool thing in the SEO world. And it’s something that we’ve been having, you know, quite a bit of impact with when it comes to optimizing our client websites. So much so that we built a whole tool based on natural language processing to make our jobs easier, which is where Rob comes in, he was the guru behind that. So if you want to check that tool out, quick plug, get a nacho AI, and your favorite web browser. But anyway, Rob, let’s talk natural language processing. Cool name sounds fancy, but what is it?

Rob  2:21
So what is natural language processing? It’s actually it’s like a sub branch of artificial intelligence and computer science. The main use of it, I guess, what Google is understand, I guess, human language in regards to content. So traditionally, Google would look more like the keywords to understand and rank content, but now it’s a lot smaller. And it looks at the users no pay to understand the intent behind sentences, the tone behind so whether or not it’s positive or negative, basically, and you can identify keywords and phrases in and, and assign what’s called entities like whether or not it’s a person. It’s an event, place and things like staying Yeah. Yes.

Michael  3:13
I think the big thing with that is, it’s Google going beyond keywords you mentioned it was before Google evolved, basically. Yeah, yeah, it’s part of them becoming Skynet. And soon they’ll be just talking to us as an, you know, totally natural conversation with Google. Sounds like our dream is SEO. But But like, basically, if you think about, like, we’ve spoken in the past about Google’s algorithm, or curl is reading content and looking at keywords to figure out what that content is about. Yeah. NLP. Is that on steroids? Yeah.

Arthur  3:44
So taking the next step away from just stuffing keywords on a page, you’re actually making sure that it makes sense and to stand on a standard. Yeah,

Michael  3:51
yeah. So read a history. This really became a factor in about 2019 When Google released Bert. So, SEO, the SEO world does what the SEO world does, when that happened, panic, have a mild panic whinge about it on Twitter, and then a whole bunch of different SEO is around the world will reverse engineer what happened and share that knowledge. And was pretty much widely agreed when that happened, that bit was looking at content, like, you know, the depth of content, the quality of the content, the matching sentiment to the search intent, you know, you know, the content matching that search intent, and basically, that’s NLP at play. So when we’re talking about it in a Google SEO sense, really NLP is in that whole bird wheelhouse. Does that all make sense? right in saying that, yeah.

Arthur  4:44
Yeah. I mean, it makes sense to me, hopefully, listeners, but

Michael  4:48
I think so. Yeah. That’s what NLP represents basically. So you mentioned entities before, places things that sort of stuff. NLP is job is to select and evaluate Wait these entities in your content? So like, let’s say, you put up an article about a movie, it’s going to read all of that and then try and extract the entities related to that movie. So it might be horror, or category directives, that sort of stuff. Right?

Rob  5:16
Yeah. I also just realized one thing. The but I will update. It’s it’s part of my name.

Michael  5:24
Wow, Robert,

Arthur  5:25
there you go.

Michael  5:26
That’s a new name. It’s meant to be a new nickname has been born. They call me but I call it Bob. Yeah, Bob’s Good. Well, there we go. That’s the groundbreaking element of this episode to

Rob  5:40
be That’s it was exactly what are the odds?

Michael  5:43
So let’s come back to the concept of entities and salience right. Tell us about like, how that works. You know, what is salience? You know, entities are the people places things like it’s just categorizing the content. But what’s the salient aspect to that?

Rob  5:59
Yep. So there’s a few schools that Google assigns to that sees. So the sentence is, is essentially how important that entity is, in the grand scheme of things. When compared to the rest of the text? How does

Arthur  6:13
it work on a scale of zero?

Rob  6:17
It goes from a scale of zero to

Michael  6:19
0.0 to 1.0. Yeah,

Arthur  6:22
that’s it. Yeah. Obviously, the higher the better. Yeah. The higher the higher,

Michael  6:27
the more salient it is. Yes,

Rob  6:29
that’s it. There’s also the sentiment score as well. And there’s also a score overall, which kind of represents the tone of the content sentence and the keyword itself, or the two entities itself? There’s also the magnitude, which is how important overall that that’s that Etsy is, but yeah, so gently, Google’s pace will pick up like how positive or negative a turn, I said this is, if I say he’ll import something that says like, this, Michael is a is very happy. Amazing. Amazing. Mike was amazing. Yeah, Mark has

Arthur  7:16
some sort of positive sentiment within that sentence, then it gives it a highest score. Yeah. And you will likely

Rob  7:20
see like the overall sentence have quite a highest sentiment. But on the contrary, if you do something that Google might not understand it, in terms of like context, maybe like Michael is not always on top or the moon, or actually Google problems out there as well, like, I guess a more abstract, more abstract, the Google might not be able to pinpoint that that’s him, it’s assigned to that. And then we just give it like a mole, like, either neutral 00 Or like, could potentially go negative, which Penguin, you’re depending on your content, you probably don’t want that.

Michael  8:00
Alright, so basically, with NLP, it’s looking at these entities. It’ll categorize the entities, it will give you salient schools, magnitude, schools, sentiment scores, all that stuff, which is all well and good. But I guess let’s maybe take a step back, right? Because this this happened a couple of years ago, this update. The reason we’re looking at Google’s NLP is it’s basically a tool or artificial intelligence that Google made a valid makes available to developers, right, like you can pay Google to use this tool. So you know, back in the day, when when we sort of learned about this, but algorithm update, and then we were seeing all this chat about NLP, we did a bit of digging and investigation ourselves, you know, let’s have a look at this tool. And we jumped on the NLP website. And the website itself was saying things like in the marketing material on the site that like, natural language processing helps Google products like search,

Arthur  8:54
we don’t say it plugs into the algorithm, basically, in a way,

Michael  8:57
in a way it says it says, NLP sort of helps search products. So it was vague, but it was also saying NLP is involved in search. Yeah. So what do we do then? Like we started testing, right? This is where speed demon bird came up with. Basically, the way we use this this NLP in optimizing content, right? So maybe if you can walk us through the early days of us testing and playing around with NLP, how would we go about it?

Rob  9:25
Right. So the early days, having fun in Google’s little demo, tedious little demo, very tedious little demo. It was very tiny. They had a small preview window.

Michael  9:40
The demo was on

Rob  9:42
his website, and basically, you will just import your what in our case, the clients, the clients content from this site. And we just vary in terms of the process. It was very, very

Arthur  9:59
well would analyze the content and spit out all the recommendations. But you were dealing with a tiny little content box? Probably what? 300 by 200? Pixel? Yeah, yeah. And it was extremely hard to edit within that box. So it was just a regular text editor. And then every time you wanted to rerun the content, you have to go back. And it was just a very manual process. Yeah. So you had to remember all the salient scores for each run? Yep. What else? I

Michael  10:24
remember that was a preview tool.

Arthur  10:27
Yeah, makes sense. But there was also also you only had a limited run. So you could do it, maybe 1015, whatever, how many times before you got locked out? And then you just got to use a VPN, if you want it to, can you continue doing it? So? Yeah, it worked. But it was just limited in what you could do. Basically,

Michael  10:44
let’s say we might take 500 words a copy, put it in this box, where you can only see one paragraph of that copy in the box. Yep. Run it via schools. That’s an I think, well, maybe we want to change like a couple of paragraphs here to try and improve our schools or, you know, influences scores. And then you’d have to go back and redo it.

Arthur  11:02
I remember Rob’s notebook that he had, every time he would sit there and you know, write down the changes that he made and how much it impacted. What keyword Yeah, so it was super manual to the point where it was, you know, pen and paper basically, yeah, times, I find,

Rob  11:15
like Mortal ways of trying to do it and trying to find which way works. And sometimes I took screenshots, and then I would print it out. And then I’m like, oh, yeah, but it got confusing. Yeah. Sometimes I put in the notebook, right, that it sees which one’s changed. I’ll put a plus one here. Plus to the this one shifted this way, I’ve made these changes.

Michael  11:34
Like analog if Yeah. If we, if we ever go into like a no, actually, I was gonna say if we ever sort of go into a dystopian future with no internet, you could still do SEO and pen and paper?

Arthur  11:47
Do you still have that notebook? Idea? Oh, maybe one day or something? Anyway, so

Michael  11:53
maybe we can share a photo of, of the notebook on

Arthur  11:56
how much has evolved from,

Rob  11:58
from, from paper to now, digital masterpiece.

Michael  12:03
So the big thing I’m hearing there, the pain points was, the tool is cool, where we’re using it to understand sentiment and salient scores and entities. But it was an absolute pain in the ass to use in any meaningful way, in a scalable way. So because let’s let’s, what we found when we were running, copy through this tool is that if we tweaked the copy and influenced the entity schools to be similar to like the top rank sites in a space, or, you know, for keywords were going after we were getting results, the rankings would improve. So that’s why we were going through this laborious process, because you know, we’re able to get results for our clients. But it was a pain. So we want it to be able to easily compare things and keep track of what’s going on without having to resort to printing out worksheets and writing on them and all the like. So we built nuts to address these pain points, right? Because no tool existed. Not yet. No tool existed, that we could find that did that right?

Rob  13:00
Yeah, after extensive research will like this tool just doesn’t exist.

Michael  13:06
So well, maybe maybe we give a little example of rankings improving or, you know, you know, I think you had an example of a, I might say the clients name, but there was that client. Yeah. Maybe give a walkthrough of the process of a process. Yeah. And the results that we saw, and why we felt that justified us investing as much time and effort and expenses we have in creating this tool, and then we’ll talk about the tool maybe?

Rob  13:31
Yeah, so I guess this particular client, can we say the niche? Doesn’t matter?

Michael  13:37
Yeah, they’re a lead generation business. Like a hire, they do hire they do hire.

Rob  13:44
Hire box. Yep. Yep. That’s all you need to know. Yeah. Yeah, essentially, it’s a the website. And I think in particular, as well, the client didn’t want to make too many visible changes in terms of the content that the user will see. So a lot of SEO content is placed beyond like a read more, or coding. And, yeah, we spent a lot of time using the natural process, the natural process to optimize its content. Because the client had previous experience in SEO, or another agency and was pretty turned off by the fact of like keyword stuffing and stuff.

Michael  14:28
So their copy in the past would have just been outsourced overseas and just read like absolute rubbish. Yeah. shoved on the site. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, actually, I’ve

Rob  14:35
done yeah, yeah. So I guess I’ll wait around. That was a thing. We’re using kUkUS natural language. So we don’t have to resort to any like, oh, this keyword stuffing. And so what happened really was around, I don’t know, probably hundreds of tests on the coffee as a whole and the manual way then anyway. And yeah, I was comparing it To talk that is in terms of the MCS because that their current, their previous copy, it says that CS was all over the place. And a lot of it was irrelevant to what the content should be about. So if this case, they’re a bit higher, let’s say they had something completely irrelevant, like mobile first design.

Arthur  15:19
So the the competitors, the I guess the entities were more related to the keyword that you wanted to rank for?

Rob  15:25
Yes, yes. So yeah, for example, let’s say, since there’s the service is a product, then the consumer good entity type was what? The competitive side. So we had to the reasoning behind the logic behind it was that if we could get the entities, the entities up there, in that sense, like Calgary type, st type, then they should rank well. And, yeah, especially after we wrote it out. After various ad changes, we saw the rankings go up quite a bit. So two weeks after we bought it out, they were on average, on the sixth and seventh position. And two weeks after they won the fourth edition, on average. And then two weeks after that, we bought another change. And they’ve been steadily going up ever since. And now they’re in position to, on average, say, doing very, very

Michael  16:26
well. And that’s weird, like, maybe a little bit of link building in the lag. But yeah, obviously, we’d roll these changes out in the site, you get Google to come back and re crawl it and rankings instantly improve.

Rob  16:37
Yep. So the funny thing is, is that this client has been with us for a while. So like, they’ve been continuing to doing link building and stuff. So to oscillate, I guess. Yeah, that was one of the main, the main changes we did. And it was after the January core algorithm update, it’s also I guess, it kind of plays into the fact that, you know, Google has massive algorithm updates, likely going to affect how they read content. So the timing of it just worked out, as well as

Michael  17:06
Yeah. And so with this latch, it’s very hard to test this stuff in isolation, because with SEO campaigns, there’s always other stuff going on, you know, technical optimization, your link building and the like. Were working, we just had that hypothesis, you know, you run this content through the tool, you get the entities and salient schools and stuff in the same ballpark as a top rank sites. And you should improve rankings. And we’ve just seen time and time again, that that works. It does work. So that’s generally the reason we created the tool we did and the process that we went through to get here. So maybe we should talk about nuts and how it solves all of your woes when it comes to things like you know, very small preview windows and not being able to track changes and not being able to compare and sort of easily review what’s going on. So um, yes to match this a little brief history of nach.

Rob  18:00
So nuts. Yes, uh, yeah, as I mentioned, there’s quite a few pain points. One of the one of the main things that was addressed with nach is that it now has a huge AV window. So you can actually say like 510 paragraphs, when you saw something in it, it just makes things a lot easier when you need to go back and change something. Another cool thing that was added was the comparison function. So now we can act now you can actually run a test. And then you can go, you can say, Run Test B. And then you can go and test it back to the original test. And you can just keep doing that.

Arthur  18:39
I guess. I was gonna say, I guess how it all started was we were just brainstorming, like, imagine, imagine we had this tool that could do all these things that you know, we can’t do now. So basically, we rob started putting together a wish list of all the things that he would love match to be NLP testing today. And that’s where it all started.

Michael  18:59
Yeah. So there’s tools built on real world SEO agency process being improved, and optimized, I guess. Yeah. Maybe we should say the name match obviously, is a slang term for natural natural language processing. We just thought that was short and sweet. We can say right, have that content been nuts yet? Yeah. Or this is gonna come on board. Let’s match them. So you know, works pretty well. Yeah, I feel it does. So. Yeah. Anyway,

Arthur  19:26
at all. It all started from a conversation really?

Rob  19:28
Yeah. Yeah, I think yeah, we brainstormed as a team as well, like, what we would want and how to make the process a lot easier. And yeah, it just came to fruition.

Arthur  19:41
Yeah, one day, I think he just said let’s build it. Yeah.

Michael  19:43
Yeah. Pretty much. So let’s, let’s talk about what we’ve built like you put the content when you run it through nach and then it will spit out all of the entities and the salient schools and all that good stuff. Then, you can maybe tweak the copy based on What you saw there and run it again. And it will show you what all the new scores are. But then you can compare the two and it will show comparison. So like next to each of them what the scores are and how they’ve changed that. And you can segment it down by different entities and see where they are in the text and the like, and very visual and quick process to get a feel for what’s going on with that content. As you change things.

Arthur  20:24
That’s a really cool feature of it. So being able to click on an entity, and then it highlighting it in the text. So you can see where they are on the page and how they grouped. And yeah, you know, that makes a massive difference, because you can then try to group different, I guess clusters of keywords together, or different entities together, which you couldn’t do before it was just impossible to kind of maybe not impossible, there would have been super hard to do that. Yeah, without it.

Rob  20:47
Like before I could get because Google likely clusters, a lot of the scenes together. And yeah, basically been able to click on it, and highlighting the ones that are in that particular group makes a lot easier to optimize for that entity. So you can go through and see what individual statuses are impacted. Yeah,

Arthur  21:08
I found that really helpful. Yeah,

Michael  21:09
even just the ability to leave, like each run, you can put notes on it. So you can sort of keep track of what you were thinking at the time or, you know, yeah, probably that’s that’s sort of how I view there just dropping out there, what I was thinking what I was planning to test at the time, very visual, it’s all stored there. And you can go back and look at it in the future. Yeah, if things change,

Rob  21:30
all the author can keep track of the changes made. So if you’ve made a change to the copy of content, and you compare it to the original, it will actually show and highlight the text changes. And so,

Michael  21:44
right, yeah, little green highlights a new stuff red for stuff that’s been deleted. That’s it.

Rob  21:48
Very visual. Very cool. Exactly. So I like because sometimes you’re not going to be doing all the testing one day, like you’ll be doing it across multiple days, it just makes things a lot easier to keep track of and then well onto the client site. Once you’re happy with it.

Michael  22:03
Maybe we should talk about some of the interesting things we’ve seen when changing text because it’s, you know, it can be as little as a capital letter, or that really changes. Yeah, the scores or the entities and has an impact on rankings. And that’s why we like doing it the way you were doing before with notes and all that. Yeah, that’s why this new version with like, sort of visual tracking of what’s been changed is so important, because it can be such a minor thing that’s changed, right? So maybe, yeah, what are some examples of that? You know, that goes on? Or?

Rob  22:36
Um, yeah, that’s it. Yeah, like you mentioned, capitalization actually goes a long way. When it comes to even Google understanding what type of Etsy it is, for example, let’s say I do flowers, for example. I do like our flowers, lowercase, lowercase f, that I’ve seen that show up as just a regular other entity. But then if you capitalize the F, it will show as a consumer, good, et Cie. So even that, like it changes quite a bit. Some other ones could be like putting like an N dash one M dash, instead of full stop. So you’re kind of extending the sentence. So it’s another, I guess, little tip that you can sort combine citizens together and the Dow kind of change quite a bit of how Google reads. So there’s a lot of really small things like, I think I’ve even seen, like binding code. It’s the semicolon, but it’s got a little comma at the bottom. Accordion,

Arthur  23:37
ah, the semicolon with the little.

Rob  23:41
Yeah, it’s basically on the naked Pay button. Yeah, yeah, I don’t know. Yeah, basically, yeah. So there’s a lot of these different little symbols that you can use, and it would just change how Google reads it.

Michael  23:52
Which is funny, right? You wouldn’t think that those things have the impact that they do. But they do, they do. So what we should make clear, I guess, is, you know, there’s tools out there in the SEO world where you can check in a URL, and the tool crawls it, and then says, Go change all of this and should get you in the ballpark. This tool is much more manual like it. It’s part art part science, you know, this tool makes it easy to see what NLP is saying, the entities and the salience and all that it’s easy to track everything, but it relies on you as the SEO to use your thinking and logic, and I guess creativity to change the copy and change things up in a way that you think is going to impact things and test it and keep trying and it’s not just a, you know, one button and done process, right? Yeah,

Rob  24:41
the shut off process. I think like experience using an OP plays a big part of it, because the more you use it, the more nuances you pick up. And yeah, I think that really differentiate between the people that use it all because obviously it doesn’t spit out any recommendations. But yeah, I think the more is that the more you kind of have a little bit of An understanding of how Google is interpreting content. But you also understand also fine things are not going to be like, what? Why?

Arthur  25:09
Well, you’ve got your little hints and tips cheat. Yeah, well, you’re not going to give away.

Michael  25:13
Yeah. So he’s got all internal processes that Rob has built based on his experience, doing a lot of this stuff that is easy to use. But there’s never going to be a tool where you just hit a button, and it gives you recommendations, like, it’s cool for you to get in there and grind it out and find that really fine tuned piece of copy that is Google, it needs to see to be the same as the top rank sites. But yeah,

Rob  25:39
I think it also in terms of like, explain to clients,

Arthur  25:42
yeah, I was gonna say that, yeah. For me personally, being able to show little changes and how much they impact certain scores of different entities has been massive, because a lot of the time without being able to share that to a client and you send them some copy with some minor changes. And they’ll look at it and be like, Well, you’ve just barely changed anything. And they might think you’re crazy. Yeah, if you can kind of demonstrate that the changes you have made to the copy, have, you know, influence these scores and these keywords and the magnitudes and all that, then it starts to make a lot of sense. And every client that I’ve shown it to so far have had really impressed Yeah, yes, go well, yeah.

Rob  26:19
Especially when, like you can they can see how many test runs? Yeah. Then. Yeah, the client will, it will help the client understand how much time goes into that? Yes. And optimize? I

Arthur  26:30
think that’s a big thing as well, because they don’t realize how much time actually goes into it. You know, you know, how did we actually get to this point?

Michael  26:36
Yeah. You just read an article what that should have taken 20 minutes?

Arthur  26:39
Yeah, really was spent two hours? Yeah. busting our brain trying to trying to get these entities to push up. So yeah, it’s for that data learn. It’s amazing.

Michael  26:48
Yeah, so it is a, it’s still a manual process. But this tool, it just makes it much more pleasant to do. Well, maybe that’s a good segue into talking about the change monitoring aspect of the tool, because like, what we found with our clients is they are prone to just adding things to sites or changing things, or deleting things, or all sorts of different modifications to a site. And that really hurts when we’ve been matching the copy for hours and getting it perfect to have things change, they might go in there make wholesale changes to the copy. Yep. So another feature we added to the tool is change monitoring, where once we have fine tuned copy, and put it up on the client site, we enter the URL of that page into the change monitor, and then natural go and crawl that page and keep a log of it in the database. And then it goes back daily, and crawls it again. And it’s looking at things like meta title tags and description tags, and page copy and heading tags and robots tags and XML sitemap, whether it has HTTPS, the download speed, like also the key SEO factors, and it keeps it all in the database. And then if anything changes, it will alert us so it alerts us via email. We’ve got integration with Slack, so we’ll get pinged on Slack, we’ve also got a Zapier web hooks, they can build all sorts of automations on the back of it. But we sort of think of this as like an insurance policy for your website, right? Because if you’re investing all this time, particularly as a client, you might you’re obviously not always going to be aware that all this effort has gone into it. And so sort of finely tuned. So you go change things and undo it. And it could be weeks or months before it’s picked up. Now I can tell you some stories about Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. So and as an SEO you, you want to be proactive, like you want to be on top of it. Definitely knowing. And so you can reach out and say, Hey, we’ve noticed you change this? Yeah, well, it

Arthur  28:47
looks great. Yeah. And like in reality, I look at client sites every day, but I don’t look at every single page on their site every day. So it could take me upwards of a week to or longer depending on the site. Yeah, to know that they’ve changed something. And by that point, it could be too late.

Michael  29:02
Yeah. And when we’re talking like full stops and capital letters, having impacts on the salient scores and entities in the leg, if the client makes a change when you’re not going to pick up on it. And it could, it could be until their rankings go backwards. And then you got to try and reverse engineer what’s happened. And by that point, they’re

Arthur  29:18
mad at you.

Michael  29:19
Yeah. What have you done? Yeah, I don’t know. And then turns out, they’ve changed something. So that now makes sure that that doesn’t happen. So I guess that we’re sort of trying to look at the whole lifecycle of this process, right? We get the client on board. We’re looking at the competition, we’re trying to improve things, get it in the same ballpark, get it live, and then make sure it stays that way. And things don’t change. Yeah, that’s just taking care of all of that.

Arthur  29:42
Did you mention that it shows you what they’ve changed as? Well? Yeah, you kinda Yeah.

Michael  29:48
It’s it’s sort of the same process as the, the NLP tool in that it will highlight you can. It has the original snapshot, and it keeps a log of all the snapshots or changes and you can use compare them. Yep. And it will show you what’s changed, has little red and green indicators. And it just makes it easy to jump in there. You can even just click View All the copy on the page and see what the copy is on the page and what it was and what’s changed. So it makes it really good to quickly fix things to be proactive to reach out to clients. If you get pinged on Slack that something’s changed, you go and see it, and then quickly call the client and say, we’ve seen this change, they’ll be like, wow, like, you’re really on top of things. So just from a client services point of view as well. It’s a really cool feature. It is.

Arthur  30:36
It is sounds like you love it more than match. And okay,

Michael  30:39
the soul match. It is not is a multi faceted FCA suite. So, um, I guess, what else is there to chat about really? Any any takeaways you want to talk about when it comes to natural NLP?

Rob  30:54
Um, yeah, Google is very, very interesting. It doesn’t like how it does concepts, although you’ll say things like, why, why why? Why is it? Yeah, definitely like that.

Arthur  31:06
Sometimes you scratch your head.

Michael  31:08
Yeah. Why? They’re not as smart as Yeah. Might be made out to be? Yeah, well, it’s

Arthur  31:11
a bit of both, you know, you look at any like, wow, yeah, Britain’s really evolved, and then you do things like add a random full stop to a sentence and be like, Okay, maybe not.

Rob  31:20
Yeah. So, yeah, it’s pretty. Yeah. I mean, it’s still, it’s still evolving. I mean, it’s pretty interesting to say that AI has gotten, like so far, that he can understand the tone behind it, because

Arthur  31:33
they’re listening to us all the time anyway. So they can, you know, capture all that data and analyze and get smarter. Yeah.

Michael  31:40
Well, I think that’s been a good intro to natural language processing, and where things are at, like, it’s a bit of a, as we said, part art part science, like a lot of things in SEO. Like we haven’t done hardcore scientific testing to prove anything in this. It’s more, we’ve had a hypothesis, we’ve done a bit of testing and we found results positive, but you can’t put your finger on exactly what’s going on with it when you when you do it. But we have found the processes, that if you can make your copy, similar in terms of entities and salience magnitude, and all the rest to the top rank sites, generally, you’ll see a ranking improvement, so just worth the time and effort to do it. Right. Correct. And it’s, it’s where Google’s headed, moving away from keywords keywords is still an important concept, but so too, is NLP and understanding sentiment and all the rest of it, and it’s only going to get more important. So if you are wanting to be on the cutting edge of SEO, then playing around with NLP play around with the preview tool or going to nach.ai and having a look at the tool we’ve got there is well worth it. Right. That’s it nice. Nice to see you there. All right. Well, Rob, how was it? How was your first time on a podcast?

Rob  32:55
Yeah, pretty good. Yeah, I mean, this is very, very fun. I’m the first guess I guess you should be back wasn’t dead. He might

Michael  33:08
become he might become a repeat guest all the time. Well, anyway, guys, thank you very much for listening as always, and if you like that, like rubber rubs crew that are tuning in, give us a give us a subscribe, give us a like, give us a review all that good stuff. Yeah. And until next time, Rob.

Rob  33:29
Next time. See you guys next time. I definitely see you guys next time.

Michael  33:32
We’ll see you back at the office. Alright, thanks.